User talk:HikaruFer/proyects1
From SpiralKnights
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Here are discussions about the projects im helping. Note: Most of the Sections have been edited to look good in this format, so i can check the messages better.
[Project] Missions
Some subpages are lacking maps and gallery but aside from that, all the missions have their own page with the gate map so i call it complete~
Mission Pages
Your work on Faith in Armor is great! Thanks! As you can imagine, there's a lot of work to do there. Many missions don't even have their own pages V_V. It's been a long slow project over the past few months - the best thing about the mission overhaul IMO is the Gate Maps (something I've wanted, and wanted to do, ever since I was a newbie) as well as the ability to just click through individual missions using the preceded/followed by section in the infobox. Like reading a book! It will get all of my focus after this acquisition project. Feel free to work on mission pages if you want, of course. 0 pressure. --Novaster 00:41, 6 September 2015 (UTC)
- Hey~ Thx ^^ i did one just in case but maybe i can help adding the format to the existences one and yes! The "Previous/Next Mission" was a really cool idea instead of going again to the mission list :D that was something i like when i saw the format ^^! The mission's format is really great, tbh most of the new format were the principal motive why i start wanting to edit, to help making everything look that nice :D! I will try to help in the proyects while i can ^^ --Hikaru 22:42, 6 September 2015 (UTC)
Parameter Gallery
Leave out the |gallery= parameter if the level is randomly generated segments, unless it has a special scenario players always run into (such as the one in An Occurrence at Owlite Keep). Looks like you're having fun! I should have some time tomorrow to do some things...then...be gone for a long time ;n; --Novaster 03:36, 19 September 2015 (UTC)
- Ohh ok then! Random = '''Gallery''', if isnt random then the |gallery=. I was going to ask too, host rank means when players can access to that mission (color image and start available) or when players can see the mission but cant enter (gray color with a lock image)?. Hahah yeah i decided to help the more i can with that, i have some dialogues for newest mission i need to transcribe too ^^. Dont be sad, u have a well winning vacations for all the great things u have done in this wiki :3! --Hikaru 03:46, 19 September 2015 (UTC)
- Nothing uses '''Gallery''' anymore, only use |gallery=. I fixed that up a while back because it was such a consistent entry it deserved its own parameter. Only use the |gallery= parameter for randomly generated areas in the situation outlined above. Of course, we always use it for set maps. --Novaster 14:42, 19 September 2015 (UTC)
"Boss Stratum Missions"
Heads up - we want to make sure the chronology of these areas is very clear. Be sure to include a notes section on mission pages, including release date. For missions which drop the player directly into a boss stratum, refer to Shadow of the Beast for examples of wording in the notes section. --Novaster 00:16, 18 September 2015 (UTC)
- Oh yeah, i trough that when i saw there wasn't page for boss missions but, i dunno, i see its easier if i put the format just to be filled later so when i start my run-mule would be easy to see what is missing and what not. I put the needs update's tag to each of ones im adding without basic info--Hikaru 00:24, 18 September 2015 (UTC)
Complicated Missions
So, many missions (mostly Dangerous Prestige) have extremely complex areas one after another, but the map is set. I don't think editors would like cropping out sections of a fixed map, so I came up with a potential solution - check out Heart of Ice: Amu-Sol. Of course, where the red text is, would be screenshots of the relevant area. Conveniently, the mini map will show the map segment the area is in, and it will always be included in the screenshot. I feel that this data is desired, because several of these pages have the data in some way, added by editors in the past. We're just organizing it. Of course, major entities such as Maulos will end up on their own pages, as part of the monster overhaul. --Novaster 17:46, 19 September 2015 (UTC)
- Oh yeah, bosses will definitive need their own page and category. I like the format, it is easy and useful, but dunno if would look better with a show/hide (dunno maybe im loving show/hide too much haha) I really doubt i could make danger mission's gallery because i suck at those xD but who knows-- Oh and u didnt tell me about the Host rank parametre --Hikaru 09:13, 20 September 2015 (UTC)
Format
Format Tips
- The Mission Goal it is almost always "Get to the elevator."
- And yeah we really have to improve the notes/exploration sections of these pages/floors. Basically, put notes in the notes section.
- Monsters don't belong in the exploration section at all, as they have their own section.
- Runthrough tips don't belong in the exploration section.
- Exploration entities as well as explaining the geography of the area belongs in this section.
--Novaster 01:20, 7 September 2015 (UTC)
- I think i understand now :P it confused me just a little the 1A 2A and those but i prefer to ask if i get to take some screen for the galleries.
- I can do the map color ^^! i was thinking in how u do it and i was right xD and HUDless would be usefull but i dont think that option wouldnt be available in a near/long future.
- One question, what u mean by: "...with as many things as standardized as possible..." and "...I've been trying to take pictures of normal, statusless areas..." i didnt get those things xD. Dunno what u meant with "standardized" and "normal, statusless"--Hikaru 01:33, 7 September 2015 (UTC)
- So like...I would prefer to take a picture in "Clockwork Tunnels: Wild Path" instead of "Blast Furnace: Wild Path." --Novaster 02:01, 7 September 2015 (UTC)
Monster Order
I see u move some mobs, it is because i have to put them like:
Beast
Construct
Fiend
Gremlin
Slime
Undead
but not by mob-alphabetic? (Like here that u add Wolver and then Alpha Wolver without being A first to W?)--Hikaru 01:38, 7 September 2015 (UTC)
- Yes, alphabetize monsters within family as well as by family. I've been trying to keep it organized by family at least. It's a huge project so it's difficult to do everything correctly the first time. --Novaster 02:05, 7 September 2015 (UTC)
Monster Template
Oh it's fine. We improved a few things. Major changes include map naming convention and the use of Template:Monster as a linking template. --Novaster 22:37, 15 September 2015 (UTC)
- Ohh i like the Monster template :D no need to add the icons all over the wiki. I will fix the mission's page now and see which one is lacking of this template ^^ --Hikaru 22:55, 15 September 2015 (UTC)
- IKR! Half a day of coding to take care of an eternity of potential mistakes. It's also faster. --Novaster 23:36, 15 September 2015 (UTC)
How to make Maps
It's an incredibly tedious cropping process. Someone wrote a script a long time ago, before we had the overlay, but I have not tried it.
- Then I color the map in with the same colors as the minimap so it's all clear.
How to take Screens
How do you "follow" a format to take screens? I created a char to make screns and gather dialogues but how do i begin? (Btw, this can be in some days first i am going to add the format to almost all and other things but just so i know :D) --Hikaru 00:20, 7 September 2015 (UTC)
- Well what I do is:
- Type /cle into the chatbox (to remove text and take care of privacy issues and clutter)
- Collapse the side menus that display your mail/forge etc, and take the screenshot with Print Screen command.
- I try to take a screenshot with as many things as standardized as possible (for my personal sandbox project I've been trying to take pictures of normal, statusless areas and update them whenever I remember to do so).
- also remove monster HP bars as these clutter the shot, but I know a few of pics have these bars. I really wish players had a HUDless option so we could take pictures like this.
- Oh and I'll have graphics on high, of course.
Image's Names
As far as naming goes, I have been tryyyyyyyyyyyying to do it like so: Area-MISSION-FLOOR.png, or just Area-AREA-Segment.png As far as I can tell, the number/letter system (the -1A, -2A bit) I came up with a while ago is more annoying than useful, so just using nothing, 2,3 might be better. --Novaster 01:06, 7 September 2015 (UTC)
Floor Wording
I did a few fixes here and there, but I have to go for tonight. These are tiny finicky things that ultimately don't matter, but are nice to keep consistent. Which is better wording, do you think - "This floor is composed of random AREANAME segments." or "An area similar to AREANAME"? We can't just say "This floor is AREANAME," because missions do not have scenario rooms in the random pool for level creation, so they are not truly AREANAME. We settled on the second one when we made gate maps (mostly), but I think the first one in general makes more sense. To save work, we'd stick with the second one. But it seems a little vague, and that's not good for a wiki, now that I'm looking at it later. --Novaster 01:39, 7 September 2015 (UTC)
- Ohh get it now! Thx ^^ i too like details so i can understand :D i will keep it them like "An area similar to AREANAME" then ^^. Will try my best, after i work sometimes in an specific format (like main list or mission page) it seems like its better to keep somethings to last, at least for me, cuz at the end of fixing all mission page, u can think "well, the mayority of the page have X thing so i can add it like X to all" and keep the consistence that, even if its not big deal, details make everything beutiful haha. I too will go to sleep soon so have a good nite~ --Hikaru 02:31, 7 September 2015 (UTC)
- Had a talk with another editor, we feel that the "This floor is composed of random AREANAME segments" is best. I shall make a template to use for this phrase and area linking...probably tomorrow. --Novaster 03:47, 8 September 2015 (UTC)
- Well I got inspired and did it. here's the template and I've fixed up all the gate maps and floor templates. Likely made a few mistakes, feel free to check (please do). Use the area template for mission pages in the floor template's exploration section, they should pretty much be copy pastes from the Gate Map, though don't mention monsters in the exploration section. --Novaster 10:50, 8 September 2015 (UTC)
- Yeah i saw ^^! Sorry i didnt reply, wasnt in the computer. Im gonna use this format then :) --Hikaru 23:07, 8 September 2015 (UTC)
- Hurray~. I'm working on the gloaming maps atm. So many little corners! The artifact project I've started shouldn't take long to complete. I'm looking forward to cleaning up the page...hopefully it won't blow up into a huge project! haha. But I'd like for users to have easier access to this content. If it's on the NPC and mission pages as well as the commemorative artifact page, I think a lot more people will be exposed to it more often. What do you think? --Novaster 23:32, 8 September 2015 (UTC)
- Oh i didnt see the recent changes till now, finally shadow of the beast have content :D. I like the Artifact added to the mission page. --Hikaru 00:00, 9 September 2015 (UTC)
- Hurray~. I'm working on the gloaming maps atm. So many little corners! The artifact project I've started shouldn't take long to complete. I'm looking forward to cleaning up the page...hopefully it won't blow up into a huge project! haha. But I'd like for users to have easier access to this content. If it's on the NPC and mission pages as well as the commemorative artifact page, I think a lot more people will be exposed to it more often. What do you think? --Novaster 23:32, 8 September 2015 (UTC)
- Yeah i saw ^^! Sorry i didnt reply, wasnt in the computer. Im gonna use this format then :) --Hikaru 23:07, 8 September 2015 (UTC)
- Well I got inspired and did it. here's the template and I've fixed up all the gate maps and floor templates. Likely made a few mistakes, feel free to check (please do). Use the area template for mission pages in the floor template's exploration section, they should pretty much be copy pastes from the Gate Map, though don't mention monsters in the exploration section. --Novaster 10:50, 8 September 2015 (UTC)
- Had a talk with another editor, we feel that the "This floor is composed of random AREANAME segments" is best. I shall make a template to use for this phrase and area linking...probably tomorrow. --Novaster 03:47, 8 September 2015 (UTC)
[Project] NPCs Pages
NPCs
So these projects really spread into each other don't they? Wiki is a giant forest full of weeds and things that need trimming. I finally got around to making the NPC infobox (something I mentioned doing idk, in January 2015? lol). I've made documentation for it and implemented it on Vaelyn's page. The reason gallery is before wares/dialogue is because those are list format entries, and can extend quite a ways down, and we like to end lists with only "see also" so users are less likely to miss things, or have to scroll to get to additional important information that's not part of list(s). This format is all over the wiki, as per...some discussion on the forums somewhere. Examples are found on individual costume and accessory pages and uh...other places. Items such as the Node Slime Crusher and stuffs. Anyway this should make the pages look really clean, so if you/other editors feel the need to work on NPCs, there's now a standard to go by. I think this is the last thing that was on my mind to get settled before I leave tomorrow. --Novaster 23:07, 20 September 2015 (UTC)
- Yeah i was seeing :D! Vaelyn's page looks clean now. I love the infobox, they are really useful. And yeah XD its huge, i was like "lalala" in the missions and then pump into NPCs so i was like "uhmm.... vaelyn is so pretty, let me fix her page" and then Konway appear too, then Feron and i was like "ok maybe i need to fix some NPCs before moving on into missiones..." xD. Glad u add that cuz i was about to fix almost all NPC's page xD. Oh and btw, i was thinking in where i have seen Kora overworld to get a clean screen of her mugshot, do u remember? i cant xD only in comlinks. --Hikaru 23:17, 20 September 2015 (UTC)
- Kora's in Hall of Heroes I think, the last one where they're all clapping. So, the template should work for complicated characters such as Herex, who is fought as a boss only sometimes, let me know if there's any issues. --Novaster 23:18, 20 September 2015 (UTC)
- You're doing a great job! I'm just denying that I have to be in the air in a few hours because my ears don't like flying. --Novaster 12:14, 21 September 2015 (UTC)
- Kora's in Hall of Heroes I think, the last one where they're all clapping. So, the template should work for complicated characters such as Herex, who is fought as a boss only sometimes, let me know if there's any issues. --Novaster 23:18, 20 September 2015 (UTC)
NPC individual vs. multiple
Hey there, still on vacation, but I had a moment here. If the NPC is a type of NPC, it needs to be in list format. For example, Nature Sprites and Spiral Wardens are types of NPCs, while "Virgil" is the name of a spiral warden type NPC. The difference becomes difficult to discern when the representatives of an NPC "species" or "race" or "type" don't have their own names, simply using the npc type in the dialogue box. I set up a demo format on Lost Soul of Almire and Lost Soul (Skull) pages, hoping to improve on the stranger page format (Which is horribly out of date and should not be redirected to "strangers", and be "Stranger," as per wiki MoS), but didn't get to it before vacation. --Novaster 04:53, 28 September 2015 (UTC)
- Hey Nova~! Well Thepc warning me about it, but i didnt know Nature Sprite would be in list format. I wanted to left Spiral Warden at the end to make it good. I can leave Spiral Warden and Nature Sprite as list (aaaaand dunno if would be the same with Knight, Gremlins, Bosses and etc) but i didnt get it, should i change Strangers for Stranger (move the page) and list ALL strangers there? BUT their pages remain the same? as Individuals? --Hikaru 06:09, 28 September 2015 (UTC)
P.D.: Bosses remain with Boss template or should i change? Feels like to change it but dunno --Hikaru 06:12, 28 September 2015 (UTC)
P.D: Strangers is that what you were saying? x//x --Hikaru 07:14, 28 September 2015 (UTC)
- It's looking like my vacation is going to be cut short, so, you can just leave it till then. Should be half a week or so before I get back. Maybe Thurs. --Novaster 16:29, 28 September 2015 (UTC)
- Ohh i see, that was pretty short :o! Well i will keep doing a few things then :) --Hikaru 21:19, 28 September 2015 (UTC)
- It's looking like my vacation is going to be cut short, so, you can just leave it till then. Should be half a week or so before I get back. Maybe Thurs. --Novaster 16:29, 28 September 2015 (UTC)
I'm just staring at recent changes procrastinating doing laundry. I will likely get to polishing the NPC stuff later today or tomorrow. --Novaster 21:07, 3 October 2015 (UTC)
- Hey there x3! haha i imagine! Was looking foward to it x3! But take your time, today im working in the spanish wiki and tomorrow i will be busy so i will can't help you. Eat, rest so tomorrow you will be frash and ready :o! haha --Hikaru 21:15, 3 October 2015 (UTC)
NPC Page Format v. 3.0
Boop. So NPCs that don't use equipment (knights or otherwise) would just use a paragraph format to describe them within the new Template:Appearance, similar to but not as involved as, say, this description of Bulbasaur on Bulbapedia. --Novaster 20:30, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
- Seems good to me :D but i find "redundant" the (Icon) [[Armor]]: Information what about (Icon *with link and alttext*): Information. Icons speak for themselves aaaaand in a weird case that someone doesnt know what that icon means, they can click and the link page will tell them. --Hikaru 20:43, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
- Hmm, so, try viewing the most recent version of Vaelyn's page. Is that better? I'm a bit annoyed by the lack of a uniform weapon icon, so I'm just using the sword for now since it's iconic for the whole game anyway. --Novaster 20:56, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
- The Sword, as i read the main list of swords, its the "main" weapon of Spiral Knight, so i think the sword icon is perfect :P! And yes ^^ seems good to me, maybe the : is annoying now that is only the icon without the link. But dunno how you see it --Hikaru 21:07, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
- EDIT: Ahhh i think they look pretty great now :D --Hikaru 21:15, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
- Okay, cool...I have no preference regarding the colons, so, I'll remove them. I'm just used to using colons in this fashion. Since it's my mess and fiddling, I'll fix the NPC pages with this new format. It's just moving around what's already there, but it's still work that I've generated. --Novaster 21:16, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
- It is true but i prefer that than an unorganized format :3 i might help you later with some of the NPCs page --Hikaru 21:28, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
- Your transparencies for the NPCs are fantastic. I imagine those will take up enough time xD --Novaster 21:32, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
- Thank you ^//^! Hahaha they will, but mostly those that doesnt have a mugshot but a store window, like Bulky and Brinks, those are tedious for not having a "fixed" size so i have to compared them to see if it works, and hate to trace they names xD (why Sullivan, why u have such a long title)- Oh that reminds me, what do you though about "titles" for NPCs? like Sullivan, would be like [[Pit Boss]]: Coliseum Rewards Supervisor instead of just "Vendor", something that, you can add vendor so the template add the category but if the NPC have a title, like Sullivan or Ricasso, will show that one instead --Hikaru 21:38, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
- Something like [[Pit Boss]]: [[Vendor|Coliseum Rewards Supervisor]] should work. NPCs can call themselves whatever they want, they're still stingy vendors with terrible prices! :P. I'm thinking we should add a small opinion tag like so: {{Note-VendorEconomics}} that says "
: It is often cheaper to obtain the recipe for an item and craft it than it is to buy it from a vendor." --Novaster 21:43, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
- Seems good :D. The template could be like:
- |type = monster
- |subtype = Pit Boss
- |role = vendor
- |subtitle = Coliseum Rewards Supervisor
- So we just need to add the subtitle parameter to the pages, i think, im just giving an idea cuz in the end, you are the one who could do the code cuz i failed miserable trying to fix a single px problem x//D. The Note could be added in the Vendor pages instead of each NPC i think :P --Hikaru 21:55, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
- Wew, tired. More tomorrow. --Novaster 00:25, 7 October 2015 (UTC)
- I think adding the subtitle bit could potentially be confusing, since there's so many different kinds. To resolve the potentially never-ending adjustment of SK's updates/dynamic "status quo," I've removed several switches and allowed manual override of the intro phrase, this way, things are a little easier to work with, but editors will have to pay a little more attention to keep things consistent. --Novaster 21:44, 10 October 2015 (UTC)
- Seems good :D. The template could be like:
- Something like [[Pit Boss]]: [[Vendor|Coliseum Rewards Supervisor]] should work. NPCs can call themselves whatever they want, they're still stingy vendors with terrible prices! :P. I'm thinking we should add a small opinion tag like so: {{Note-VendorEconomics}} that says "
- Thank you ^//^! Hahaha they will, but mostly those that doesnt have a mugshot but a store window, like Bulky and Brinks, those are tedious for not having a "fixed" size so i have to compared them to see if it works, and hate to trace they names xD (why Sullivan, why u have such a long title)- Oh that reminds me, what do you though about "titles" for NPCs? like Sullivan, would be like [[Pit Boss]]: Coliseum Rewards Supervisor instead of just "Vendor", something that, you can add vendor so the template add the category but if the NPC have a title, like Sullivan or Ricasso, will show that one instead --Hikaru 21:38, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
- Your transparencies for the NPCs are fantastic. I imagine those will take up enough time xD --Novaster 21:32, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
- It is true but i prefer that than an unorganized format :3 i might help you later with some of the NPCs page --Hikaru 21:28, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
- Okay, cool...I have no preference regarding the colons, so, I'll remove them. I'm just used to using colons in this fashion. Since it's my mess and fiddling, I'll fix the NPC pages with this new format. It's just moving around what's already there, but it's still work that I've generated. --Novaster 21:16, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
- Hmm, so, try viewing the most recent version of Vaelyn's page. Is that better? I'm a bit annoyed by the lack of a uniform weapon icon, so I'm just using the sword for now since it's iconic for the whole game anyway. --Novaster 20:56, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
NPC Template
It's better to be consistent. Either add the bullet to location too, and remove the duplicates from each individual page, or remove the bullet from the template and add it to each individual page for roles. It is a lot better to have flexibility, so I'd go with the "no bullets in the template" option. --Novaster 23:25, 8 November 2015 (UTC)
- I'm/we're going to have to go in and fix all the pages either way, so before you do more, really decide what to do. --Novaster 23:44, 8 November 2015 (UTC)
- Well, usually NPCS have only one role so it is better if in the role parameter we can add the bullet to the template, because there will be not mistake, its always (havent seen a NPC who have two roles) one role so it will avoid users to mistakenly put a bullet in one page, and not in the other. But in locations is different, usualy a NPC have more than one location, so the bullet needs to be added with the [[Text]] so i though it wouldnt be necesary to add the bullet in location, only in role (all knights have the role without bullet, almost all gremlins too, havent re-checked the rest of them). Oh and im adding a tag of update (to boss template) for those who have NPC's template --Hikaru 23:49, 8 November 2015 (UTC)
- I wouldn't bother with the tag...the pages are functioning (this reformat is not vital) and the tag makes it look pretty messy. And I probably won't get to it for a long time. Regarding consistencies, you can't make exceptions with that mindset, otherwise templates would be a mess all over the place. Pick one or the other, and I'll fix the pages. Options are bullets in the template, or no bullets in the template. I would go with no bullets in the template. Mistakes are less likely to be made with copypasting as long as the sources are consistent. --Novaster 23:55, 8 November 2015 (UTC)
- Well, in that case, no bullets in the template would be. Im actually doing that right now with the NPCs. So gonna fix all those * before forgetting --Hikaru 23:58, 8 November 2015 (UTC)
- Alright, as long as it's fun. I try very hard to clean up my own messes, even if it's an extrapolation via another editor's good faith work. Since the template is my design, it's my mess. To avoid edit conflicts I'll let you have at it. I'll put in more linking examples for the Template:Fileinfo. --Novaster 00:06, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- If you want you can but more examples. But it was mostly for the "main item" because the previous template have it and the new didnt. So want to be sure xD. Oh and dont worry about the "mess" i can understand about that so no biggy :) i just want to do things ^^ --Hikaru 00:21, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Alright, as long as it's fun. I try very hard to clean up my own messes, even if it's an extrapolation via another editor's good faith work. Since the template is my design, it's my mess. To avoid edit conflicts I'll let you have at it. I'll put in more linking examples for the Template:Fileinfo. --Novaster 00:06, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Well, in that case, no bullets in the template would be. Im actually doing that right now with the NPCs. So gonna fix all those * before forgetting --Hikaru 23:58, 8 November 2015 (UTC)
- I wouldn't bother with the tag...the pages are functioning (this reformat is not vital) and the tag makes it look pretty messy. And I probably won't get to it for a long time. Regarding consistencies, you can't make exceptions with that mindset, otherwise templates would be a mess all over the place. Pick one or the other, and I'll fix the pages. Options are bullets in the template, or no bullets in the template. I would go with no bullets in the template. Mistakes are less likely to be made with copypasting as long as the sources are consistent. --Novaster 23:55, 8 November 2015 (UTC)
- Well, usually NPCS have only one role so it is better if in the role parameter we can add the bullet to the template, because there will be not mistake, its always (havent seen a NPC who have two roles) one role so it will avoid users to mistakenly put a bullet in one page, and not in the other. But in locations is different, usualy a NPC have more than one location, so the bullet needs to be added with the [[Text]] so i though it wouldnt be necesary to add the bullet in location, only in role (all knights have the role without bullet, almost all gremlins too, havent re-checked the rest of them). Oh and im adding a tag of update (to boss template) for those who have NPC's template --Hikaru 23:49, 8 November 2015 (UTC)
Or
- Merchant: Elemental Defender
Or
- Merchant
- Elemental Defender
Or
- Elemental Defender (confusing I think)
Or
- Merchant (Elemental Defender)
For NPCs such as Archilus? The point of this section of the infobox is to state a generalized role, and "elemental defender" doesn't really reveal anything to nubbies, even though it is what he is labelled as in-game. --Novaster 00:10, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Will go with the second option
- Merchant: Elemental Defender
- Merchant: Elemental Defender
- But, wouldnt it be Vendor? or do i keep Merchant? --Hikaru 00:21, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Shoot yes, vendor. Argh :P --Novaster 00:28, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Hahaha though somewhere, sometime, read "do no use Merchant, use vendor instead" so i was confused hhaha. So
- Vendor: Elemental Defender
- Would be :3 --Hikaru 00:30, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Sounds good to me. And yeah, I think I wrote that, BECAUSE it's so easy to derp like this. Vendor is more appropriate than merchant for an umbrella term, considering both the in-game conventions as well as the real-world definitions. --Novaster 00:32, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Hahaha i think i keep it in mind because when i did a test traslating "Vendors who sell this item" to the ES wiki it give me problems because Sell is Vender and Vendors is Vendedores, the two words sounds the same and sound pretty dumb and redundant in spanish "Vendedores que venden este articulo" hahaha xD so i was like... okay what else i can do *leaves slowly* Im still giving it time till the adquisiton proyect is done so i can think what word i can used to replace "Vendors" or "sell" the one that fits and traslate better xD. Thats is a fun fact now that i think lol. Well going to start copy/editing :3! --Hikaru 00:43, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Sounds good to me. And yeah, I think I wrote that, BECAUSE it's so easy to derp like this. Vendor is more appropriate than merchant for an umbrella term, considering both the in-game conventions as well as the real-world definitions. --Novaster 00:32, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Hahaha though somewhere, sometime, read "do no use Merchant, use vendor instead" so i was confused hhaha. So
- Shoot yes, vendor. Argh :P --Novaster 00:28, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
NPC Page Divisions
Don't add repeated sections. The changes made to the various NPC pages divide the page up into repeated, tiny sections (description and appearance are too similar, and NPCs don't have official in-game descriptions anyway like items and certain locations do). We're going to have to revert those changes. --Novaster 05:02, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Yikes. How many pages was this done to? I can try to start at the beginning of the alphabet and work forward while you go backwards. --Novaster 05:04, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- But isn't important to said what is the purpose of that NPC? We can change the "description" but we need to said what that NPCs does and/or what its its purpose, and the Notes said "Release/patch notes/game build history, interesting things, etc" not "all info about the npc" right? --Hikaru 05:06, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Yes, it's important to have the information. As far as I can tell, this information was already in the notes section for most of these pages. It's not enough information to have its own section, and NPCs don't have official descriptions, so having a description section is both redundant, cluttered looking, and confusing. --Novaster 05:08, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Though there is some archaic leftovers from the previous bad format. That's why we're updating the pages - they're inconsistent or nonexistent. --Novaster 05:10, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Well but it seem good with NPCs page with low-info but with alot-info they look clutter (dunno if thats the word, chubby, big, a bus full of people xD). Wikias have a resumen (mostly, what the thing/person/mosnter/ is-do) and then the sub sections, and is a tiny info because the detailed one goes in others sections right? --Hikaru 05:12, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Not sure what you mean. Larger sections are superior to smaller sections as long as the information flows and the subject is either relatable, or there's a bunch of small things that don't belong in their own sections (such as a single point of history, if we have a lot of history, then we add a history section). Imagine reading a book with a bunch of unnecessary chapter breaks. You really only want a new section when there's a content change. The point is to divide for the sake of navigation (you can link directly to sections with URLs), and we don't want to do that here because the stuff is too similar and/or too small. --Novaster 05:19, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Well but it seem good with NPCs page with low-info but with alot-info they look clutter (dunno if thats the word, chubby, big, a bus full of people xD). Wikias have a resumen (mostly, what the thing/person/mosnter/ is-do) and then the sub sections, and is a tiny info because the detailed one goes in others sections right? --Hikaru 05:12, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- But isn't important to said what is the purpose of that NPC? We can change the "description" but we need to said what that NPCs does and/or what its its purpose, and the Notes said "Release/patch notes/game build history, interesting things, etc" not "all info about the npc" right? --Hikaru 05:06, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
If you think the page could look better, talk about it here. Argh. The use of "you" in an article is so bad lol. More leftovers from the archaic times. --Novaster 05:31, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
Another minor format issue that is a major personal peeve of mine: overlinking. Terms shouldn't be linked more than once in an article, in general, when you're reading in paragraph format. Exceptions of course include template repeats. More information here. I have "remove repeated linking" in more than several edit comments :P --Novaster 05:34, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Well i can undo manually the description implementation and leave it with the info in notes as they (mostly) were. Im doing that right now, and also eliminating the overlinking, but the wording (what u did with archilus) must be other time because going to eat and sleep soon xD --Hikaru 05:36, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- I did Armero so i removed the link in the Dialogue tab (because isnt template). Do that with the others? --Hikaru 05:39, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- It's a lot of work keeping the wiki clean, and very painful when you generate more work for yourself. I wish someone would have stopped and helped me when I made this in the past - it was very bad, just check the version history. But all ppl did was say "that's nice" when glancing at it and I never saw the complaint in the discussion tab until years later, and after I'd learned quite a lot.
Definitely leave the link in the dialogue section tabs. That's part of the template system and it's in its own section - so it's format and convenience. Repeated linking is, as emphasized in the wiki article, mostly an issue when reading/writing in paragraph format. --Novaster 05:41, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
Here's some more information about sections and section content. Because we are a gaming wiki, we don't perfectly follow all of wikipedia's conventions (especially with names). We rarely encounter an article that has a section that's too big. Our problem is sections that are too small, because the game has such limited, distinct information. What was the NPC's childhood like? Did they hatch from an egg? All kinds of missing things. --Novaster 05:49, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Well that happens xD see me that i just have less than three months. The fact that the OOO-SK team doesnt make a format and practically gives the wiki to whoever wants to edit (if noone would like to edit this wiki would be empty or out-ofdate ALOT) so i dont take it "take serious" (that everything must be perfect) i like consistence but well, mistakes happen xD. I was mostly guiding by the Style Guide's format so, ni the next cases we should be really sure what looks good, where the [[]] would appear (like, we add the bracet to the gallery caption but later we see its overlinking) and just test it in 3~5 pages, at the end of the week we probably would come out with a consistent format and we can start implemented it. It is mostly because if we took too much testing because we dunno would fit better then we will never end xD. Maybe we can ask in the Forum if we're not sure but nor all people comment, so its a slow to the process. But well, this can all be fixed :) --Hikaru 05:59, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
I've been thinking about an intro section, because it does LOOK better than notes underneath appearance, but notes should absolutely never be at the top of a page. I have gone to the forums regarding NPCs, but pretty much nobody except me, you, and Ciardha really (currently) care about putting the work into the pages of these guys. It should always be fun, yes, and I am sorry if I sound serious - I try not to sound mean serious, but I often come across as stiff. But yeah...node 107407 - some outdated discussion mostly about dialogue. I wouldn't reply to the thread, it wouldn't be helpful, but it should show how many individuals just LOVE EDITING NPC PAGES. --Novaster 06:08, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
Okay, I poked around wikipedia looking at articles about people, and noticed that a lot of them have obese intro sections. So against my instinct I tried it out on the Barrus and Archilus pages. What do you think? Remember to shrink your window and pretend you have a tiny monitor when looking at these things. --Novaster 06:14, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
I didn't think I would like it this way, but I kinda do. It mimics the behavior of a description and lets the "appearance" section flow into the "gallery" section. I'm thinking we should sleep on this before putting any more work into it though. --Novaster 06:16, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
For the HoH vendors appearance, I'm thinking instead of the 5*, we say something like "Owlite Shield line" etc. and below the template say "Depends on rank." I'll put another test edit in. But definitely should sleep on it. --Novaster 06:33, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- I do like it. I think thats what my eyes need xD! Well, after fixing the description's tab i would sleep :) but first, see this Photoshop Time i did (800x600) --Hikaru 06:36, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- And the HoH Vendors idea is great :D it put all the items without being wrong.
Then again that might be too repetitive. But leaving it at the 5* is inherently wrong, just as describing Bulky during only the Dark Harvest would be wrong. Argh. Definitely going to sleep on it. And yeah, I always shrink my window when testing new format, there are plenty of phone users out there. We shouldn't cater to that because we are a wiki with a huge amount of information but we should make sure pages are squishy. Admittedly I am disappointed that Zebulon's chromalisk tank is always a little baby, and not scaled to tier. I kid. The fact they all change outfits is amazing. --Novaster 06:39, 9 November 2015 (UTC) Here I am staring at apostrophes at 1:45 in the morning regarding Archilus's vs. Archilus'. Goodnight. --Novaster 06:45, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Lol xD. Well, as a Spanish user, Archilus's is better. But in grammar, i cant give much feedback, not a pro and i cant spell words like "appearance" without thinking twice xD. Nite~ --Hikaru 06:50, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Yeah it doesn't matter either way, so let's use the one that is better for more languages. Even though it's the Eng wiki. I have done a few more modifications to Archilus's'ss''s's page, take a look. I've uploaded pictures of Archilus so we can really see what the page will look like when it's finished. IDK if you were really gunning to do those, so I only did them for Archilus just for page testing. --Novaster 18:22, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Its awesome~ And notes could be added "if any" like the dialogue and wares. Wegner is a good NPCpage to test, he have info + history (and i super mega support the format of history in wegner for all pages!). Biscotti and Kozma could be used for test too. I support this format :). --Hikaru 21:06, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Yeah it doesn't matter either way, so let's use the one that is better for more languages. Even though it's the Eng wiki. I have done a few more modifications to Archilus's'ss''s's page, take a look. I've uploaded pictures of Archilus so we can really see what the page will look like when it's finished. IDK if you were really gunning to do those, so I only did them for Archilus just for page testing. --Novaster 18:22, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
NPC Format: Newer
So, I know before we discussed heavily the NPC page format, but now that we've actually been working with pages, it's of course run into several hiccups. I've decided to move the gallery down to the bottom (many game/anime wikis have a gallery at the bottom, my favorite is pages such as this one on the Homestuck wiki, but they put their "notes" (trivia, which SK editors have decided to wipe out, replacing with notes) under the gallery, which looks bad for our wiki because we don't use Wikia's base chassis.
So I've adjusted Wegner and Archilus again...what do you think now? Wares are closer to the top...which for some NPCs, especially Basil, is more desired information anyway.
I might not be able to do much today. Big tummy ache. --Novaster 22:43, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
Yeah, I am liking the gallery on the bottom much better. It's a consistent format with other wikis and equipment pages such as Obsidian Edge. The only pages that seem to break it are pages such as Bolted Vee and so on, but that's essentially a giant sortable gallery that potentially expands down forever, so having any information besides "see also" after such a thing would be very inconvenient. What I'm annoyed about now is the history section, some NPCs have a lot, most don't, but it should be in the same location on the page so people can find the information easily. But then we end up with ittybitty sections. Just argh. How I got around this before was the notes section. It's all very frustrating. --Novaster 22:55, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Well it now fit with other page's format like weapons page right? A short organization would be:
- (What is, what does, etc, descirption but without tab)
- Appearance (with template if its knight)
- Wares (if any)
- Dialogue (if any)
- Notes (if any, and if there is notes)
- History (if any)
- Gallery
- See Also
Right? I add "notes" because it could be:
==Notes== ===History=== Text
If there is only history, wegner could be:
==Notes== Allusions ===History=== Text
Well, i said it to keep all as the same, and keep History with thre === right? or we can add Notes, History, Gallery with all having ==
But we can discuss that later :) im taking care of the images so u can rest for your tummy ache ^^ take medicine to gel well~ --Hikaru 23:06, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- I have incorporated this into "test 2" edits of Wegner and Archilus pages. I am a stubborn type... if I suddenly stop editing, you'll know why. Napping off the tummy ache. If you think test 2 edits look good, I'll try them out on a few other NPC pages I think will be problematic. --Novaster 23:14, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Test 3 puts the dialogue above the gallery below notes. I think I'd be happy with this overall. --Novaster 23:26, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
- Test 3. Dialogue between notes and gallery looks good! Not all notes-info above (in "description") but neither no-info. Just a little thing, we should write "Town Square" not "Haven Town Square", same with others (Like Garrison and Bazaar) it only exist one of each, and, in the strange case somehow SK release a new town with another town square/garrison/bazaar, take in count that we can make redirects and still, need to create new pages like Town Square (Haven, and Town Square (NewCity) xD So i think we are safe to put Town Square, Garrison, Bazaar, Arcade, and so on, only, not "Haven Bazaar" or that. --Hikaru 00:51, 10 November 2015 (UTC)
- Yeah, I agree. No need for Haven before these areas. We can always fix it later in the extremely unlikely event they make more elaborate towns outside of Haven. --Novaster 01:14, 10 November 2015 (UTC)
- Okay then :3! Im not gonna add the format because we're still testing it but only fix those Haven Etc that were left behind because i fix some yesterday. Hope you feel better with your ache ^^! --Hikaru 01:22, 10 November 2015 (UTC)
- Yeah, I agree. No need for Haven before these areas. We can always fix it later in the extremely unlikely event they make more elaborate towns outside of Haven. --Novaster 01:14, 10 November 2015 (UTC)
- Test 3. Dialogue between notes and gallery looks good! Not all notes-info above (in "description") but neither no-info. Just a little thing, we should write "Town Square" not "Haven Town Square", same with others (Like Garrison and Bazaar) it only exist one of each, and, in the strange case somehow SK release a new town with another town square/garrison/bazaar, take in count that we can make redirects and still, need to create new pages like Town Square (Haven, and Town Square (NewCity) xD So i think we are safe to put Town Square, Garrison, Bazaar, Arcade, and so on, only, not "Haven Bazaar" or that. --Hikaru 00:51, 10 November 2015 (UTC)
NPC Format: almost there!?
Oh I remember why I started doing "Haven Town Square" etc. - it was because of the "Arcade" mission/exploration interface vs. the Haven Arcade location in Haven. Oh well. What do? --Novaster 11:10, 15 November 2015 (UTC)
After much napping upon this issue, I find myself most pleased with Archilus' page format. This would result in this format (I restored the linking in the brackets, as that's part of a template system and is convenient per section - overlinking is mostly an issue in paragraph format). If you agree with this layout, I will press forward with changes. --Novaster 10:41, 15 November 2015 (UTC)
I have made what I think is a better, less repetitive, more clear, less confusing, blahblah template for vendors. It needed to be done because their format is so...not in-sync with the rest of the wiki. It's still very beta, but I stuck it on Archilus' page for testing. What do you think so far? It might influence our format decisions. --Novaster 22:19, 17 November 2015 (UTC)
I have also put a demo on Talk:Brinks because he has an inventory with a lot of item type variety. My main goal is to ensure players understand that the vendor sells an ITEM, vs. a RECIPE for that item, and to make sure they don't miss that certain items can be bought with different things - Rock Salt for example, or Dark Harvest Prize Boxes for different candy tokens, and so on. If you like the format, feel free to make more entries, cross-referencing with in-game proofs and Miss-Nice's data to make sure it's up to date, because many pages are out of date. Or say you don't like it/there's problems.
And finally, how does this vendor list template influence our decision with the NPC page general format? (Should it be called WaresList instead?) I continue to prefer this version of Archilus the most. --Novaster 00:14, 18 November 2015 (UTC)
Considering the nature of the vendorlist template, and the general format of the entire wiki (players will likely try to find items via the main lists or the item pages, not NPC pages), I'm thinking it would be best to put wares on the bottom, above "See Also." The logic is the same as other pages with lists - lists are large and potentially forever-downward expanding, having content besides "see also" after lists isn't prudent. It also makes sense, because many lists are essentially sortable galleries (something I mentioned previously), though vendor lists are not as gallery-like as others. As soon as we agree, I'll make the changes, since I'm the one making a fuss about it and it would ultimately be my mess.
Compare:
- this version of Archilus, which I currently like the most
- this version of Archilus, which I like a lot, but now, not as much as the one above
I think letting the gallery have more than 3 per row really makes a huge difference, we just have to be careful, because not everyone has a large monitor. It looks fine on my laptop, which has a rather small screen. It will be horrid for phone browsers, but since this is a gaming wiki with a lot of information, catering to phones isn't prudent. --Novaster 01:01, 18 November 2015 (UTC)
- Hey Nova~ how r u? ive been busy this days, well, i prefer the current version, the table does look a little big but i like it :) consistency :3. But i would change Notes for another word, and change the text to just Rank #-# because the "this items become etc etc" looks repetitive and innesesary, i put my browser tinier and make it "wider" (i think thats the word xD) but dunno which word can replace notes. On other news, i did update Brinks's inventory some weeks ago with MissNice's screen :) so its on date. Uhmmmm what else.... Oh well, Archilus' current page looks good, galery with 3 rows, wares at the bottom below see also. And the template of wares lookds good :) the name of the template its good, vendor sounds find. Gonna try to do some things before my free time runs out lol xD --Hikaru 00:52, 20 November 2015 (UTC)
- What about the table on Talk:Brinks? Good? Bad? If Archilus' current page is fine, I will go ahead with the changes. I've made the HoH statement per row part of the vendorlist template, so we can easily change it whenever we want. And due to the arcade vs. Haven arcade thing, I think we should stick with Haven Garrison, Haven Town Square, etc. - because I remembered why I started doing it. --Novaster 02:27, 20 November 2015 (UTC)
- Brinks is good :) but cost should be sorted so we can see the minimun. And about Haven (place) well, i did erase the ones i saw xD but ther is some other i didnt. Should stick forever with Have *place* then xD. In another note, i will probably wont be editing in a long time so thats why i been inactive, and probable will take a while till i can edit again :( i will try to finsih the transparency of the NPCs thats left tho --Hikaru 01:04, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
- Oh nu. Well, I'm sure the transparencies will be bootyfull :). Regarding the sortability of the cost column, I was hoping to just maintain least to greatest (least at top, increasing down, within currency types) within the list, since sortability is very dumb unless you force it in the code (depends on first number in a number string, not the value of the entire number string directly) - and dual payment methods with more than one token type complicates things further. I can try to work it out if it's that important. In the meantime, looks like I have a ton of editing to do and no excuse to not do it! --Novaster 01:40, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
- Oh well if it is a pain to do then doesnt need to :) though it would be simple to add but ur are right xD. Still the rest of the table is perfect :3! --Hikaru 03:05, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
NPC Page Format v. 3.1
It seems to be going well. For the galleries, I'm thinking we could move what I view as a redundant bit:
- "NAME" as they appear in (the) "PLACE."
- Could be instead:
- "NAME" in (the) "PLACE."
--Novaster 21:44, 10 October 2015 (UTC)
- Oh, i was looking at the recent changes to see what switches did you mean, i think i know which ones now xD. I like it now! Much better i think, the "role" is more importante alone than with the "NPC:". And about the galliers, yeah those were a bit redundant (and kinda long xD) i was going to said the "PAGENAME" would be redundant too buuut without it, i dunno, it doesnt look good. I vote for what you proposed: "PAGENAME" in (the) [[PLACE]]. Will going to change it in the format template :) --Hikaru 00:20, 11 October 2015 (UTC)
- PD: oh and about titles, is a shame :( i dunno i like those titles! But what you said makes sense --Hikaru 00:26, 11 October 2015 (UTC)
- Thanks :). The Spiral Warden page took a lot more work than I thought it would (had to find proof for eeeeeeverything and I'm still very uncertain about the release dates). I'm logging off the wiki for today, well, regarding major edits. There's still more work to be done with the page, especially with images and individual page format (nobody made a page for Virgil?!), which I probably won't get to for a while, but I'll try tomorrow. Have fun! --Novaster 01:22, 11 October 2015 (UTC)
Image Information
I feel that image information is a project for way down the road (the idea to do them popped into my head a while ago, after seeing images around other wikis where people had items that weren't the focus of the image and not knowing what they were was driving me insane). I'll certainly help with them, but right now NPCs, Monsters, and then Areas are taking priority. --Novaster 00:16, 25 November 2015 (UTC)
- Oh yeah, im just finishing it because i left it in the half. I have a little time so i try to finished it if i can but for new overworld's file it could be added (at least, a note of item without the template) --Hikaru 00:18, 25 November 2015 (UTC)
- As long as it's fun. I was worried it was being unfun based on the comment for help xD. I'm off for tonight, going to try to do one NPC page a day until they're done. The problem with these things is that they get all tangential with other topics, and I think I'll have to finish fixing Punch tomorrow. Really wish that Variant Forge interface wasn't so convoluted with the ticket icons. --Novaster 00:36, 25 November 2015 (UTC)
- Ohhh haha dont worry :) wouldnt do it if it wasnt fun. Gambatte~ with the NPC's pages, sorry i cant help with that ^^U! Nite~ --Hikaru 00:39, 25 November 2015 (UTC)
- As long as it's fun. I was worried it was being unfun based on the comment for help xD. I'm off for tonight, going to try to do one NPC page a day until they're done. The problem with these things is that they get all tangential with other topics, and I think I'll have to finish fixing Punch tomorrow. Really wish that Variant Forge interface wasn't so convoluted with the ticket icons. --Novaster 00:36, 25 November 2015 (UTC)
[Project] Acquistion Sections
Last Status: Completing Vendor's data
Tbh i dont recall what i was doing with this? haha i dunno if it was finished (for what i can see right now, it is) but im focusing on images and consistency of pages so this is a dropped project for me.
(1º) First Phase
Acquisiton 1.0
We are working on populating User:HexZyle/Template:RecipeLocation with data for equipment items. If you wish to help with this format (I think you do, based on Template talk:Page/Weapon), mimic this format exactly for each item. Discussion about this format can be found here, please stick with this format. It's been worked through quite meticulously considering all the standardized acquisition scenarios we can think of.
- Do not implement the template in the mainspace - after we've added all the item entries, we will put all the coding content into an appropriately named template.
- Then we begin the next phase - implementation. Each page needs thorough checking to make sure no methods are missed, as the template is implemented. It will be an arduous process.
If there's something weird about an item, talk about it here. I'll be adding various examples that are not vendors (such as prize boxes) and improving the system with a Brinks template after lunch today. --Novaster 16:57, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
- I dunno there existed one xD! I found all these template and text in some of the gun-sword-shield list, i was confused at first that just some had a template (like Machine) and others doesnt (just the text) but trough, like u said, was low priority, but didnt think i could be used un a complete template. Seems cool! What can i do :D? I will number a few things and u tell me if i do or do not.
Things i need to remember for the Template- Keep "Vendors who sell the recipe for this item:" in all items (and "Vendors who sell this item:" too)
- In case of "Reward" and "Vendor", i keep this: *The recipe for this item is a reward for completing the {{mission|Sewer Stash}} (bound)"
- And if its just an item (no recipe) i change it like: *This item is a reward for completing the {{mission|Sewer Stash}} (bound)"
- Add a tempalte for Santuary Machine like the Mysterious one
- When its PrizeBox or Machine (Santuary or Mysterious) i dont add anything (like "Vendors who sell the recipe for this item" and etc)
- Do i compile information from the actual pages to make the template?
- Items that will go there are Armour (Without the news from gunnerupdate), Helmet (i guess the same as armour), Shields, Bombs, Handguns and Sword right? With all an their skins?
Order of the Information- SignUp/Bundles/Especial
- Mission Reward
- Item
- Recipe
- Item (Vendors)
- Bazaar Vendor (Alphabetical)
- Recipe (Vendors)
- Basil (plus lobby)
- HoHVendor (Alphabetical)
- Bazaar Vendor (Alphabetical)
- Rare Drop/Others
--Hikaru 19:21, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
- That seems right, except do NPCs alphabetically. Do a few entries and I'll check them. After that you will be a mindless robot. --Novaster 19:31, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
- Aye~Aye~ then! Thx x3!--Hikaru 19:47, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
- Also, for the compiled information, yes, just basically put it into the new format in the template...making sure the methods are legitimate/up to date in-game wouldn't hurt, but I don't think we've had any major updates regarding changes to this...at least, not like materials. Whew. --Novaster 19:59, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
- I will edit it in an outside note (in my pc) after i have all i will check, which would be the tedious part. --Hikaru 20:24, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
- Also, for the compiled information, yes, just basically put it into the new format in the template...making sure the methods are legitimate/up to date in-game wouldn't hurt, but I don't think we've had any major updates regarding changes to this...at least, not like materials. Whew. --Novaster 19:59, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
- Aye~Aye~ then! Thx x3!--Hikaru 19:47, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
Order of the Template
Btw, before starting, should i add them per item? Like, >Helmet>Shield>Bomb>Handgun>Swords and stars?. Like, Aegis and Ancient Plate are 5* shields, acheron is 5* and avenger is 4*. So it will be in that order and not: Acheron, Aegis, Ancient and Avenger. Which one should i use? (I know the all "A" in alphabetical is the actual one but seems like it is better to find if its by type and then star, or just type seems good too) --Hikaru 20:24, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
- It doesn't matter since it's an internal template. Do whatever is easier for editors. By item type would likely be a lot better. (I would keep reskins as their own type, regardless of the item's actual type). --Novaster 20:33, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
- For me, its easy if its by Type (then Star) because i dont get lost easily, i would keep Reskins as the 7th type then, after sword so everything seems in an order --Hikaru 20:40, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
(2º) Second Phase
Acquisition 2.0
I have made a few test changes to the master acquisition template with individualized vendor templates with star switches. Some of these templates are a bit weird, and don't pertain to the vendor so much as the information we specifically want to display in relation to the master template. Their only function is to let us consistently enter the same phrase/price pattern and easily change that phrase/pricing in the future as needed. Using the PAGENAME switch for these vendors is a worse option for this particular expression of data, considering that the master acquisition template already uses a pagename switch, and having to update vendor templates in addition to vendor pages whenever the game changes would be a real hassle, especially when we can just use a switch that follows star pricing patters. I used the PAGENAME switch for Brinks because he's a bit of an odd vendor with lots of different item types for sale. If the other vendors weren't so consistent/simple, we'd likely have to do them as we did with Brinks, but maybe not. --Novaster 22:26, 1 September 2015 (UTC)Template for Vendors
I have also reworded vendors so that they have the same kind of information. New templates:
These are working very well. You/me can make templates for the other vendors easily and carefully add them to the acquisition template. One thing that concerns me now is the size of the acquisition template. It would probably be smart to split it into Acquisition/Defense, Acquisition/Offense, Acquisition/Misc (for trinkets and other misc items). --Novaster 22:26, 1 September 2015 (UTC)
- About new vendor's template seems good :D, but there is not a way to add greave (and the other vendors, not vatel ofc) in the same Bazaarvendor's template? same as Greave individualy but all in one. I think, right now, Greave's template will work like: (Greave|randomly|2) right? dunno if there is a way to be: (BazaarVendor|Greave|randomly|2) dunno if that its better or would be a mess XD. Ofc Vatel is foreveralone with its own template cuz he sells recipes but others seems to have the same pattern of prices and the randomly/always is already in the code. Btw i like that u change the HoHVendor, the name= and star= wasnt so necesary, i find it simplier now :D. Did u make the change in the master template? i couldnt do much yersterday after afternoon and its the same for today xD but tomorrow will be different. I can help with making the code for the other's vendor but want to ask first what u think of BaazarVendor with the 4 (i think there are four of them) of vendors --Hikaru 23:29, 1 September 2015 (UTC)
- I think we should do each relevant vendor in BaazarVendor, to be similar to HoH. And yes I made the change to the master template with the HoHvendor. I am leaning more towards PAGENAME for universal use. What do you think? --Novaster 23:37, 1 September 2015 (UTC)
- Here are the new Vendor's templates:
- --Hikaru 23:48, 1 September 2015 (UTC)
- I think we should do each relevant vendor in BaazarVendor, to be similar to HoH. And yes I made the change to the master template with the HoHvendor. I am leaning more towards PAGENAME for universal use. What do you think? --Novaster 23:37, 1 September 2015 (UTC)
Report
Okay, been messing around with the coding, it will be better to have the bazaar vendors in their own templates for flexibility due to their different kinds of items. HoHVendors all have recipes with 100% consistent pricing patterns (thank goodness, otherwise we'd try to go after "that one vendor who happens to pay more/sell for less" and have to template that! ew). --Novaster 00:19, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
- Hahaha yeah! the HoH is simple because of that but would be horrible if it have all diferent prices OTL! haha. I like it the way it is now haha --Hikaru 00:38, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
- I see this happening in a few phases now. First we make the vendor templates, then we make the acquisition templates, move the data from the master template into them, and gradually populate them/error check, then implement/error check. So what I would do is pick a vendor who's not greave or vatel and start making a template for them that's like Template:Vatel. I'll work out the kinks with Greave, and remove the use of Template:Vatel/Recipe. --Novaster 00:44, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
- Hold off a sec, I have to make a switch for "always" vs. "randomly" --Novaster 00:46, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
- Should be good to replicate code now. --Novaster 00:55, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
- So i can take Greave's template and work with it for the rest (Kragen and etc) right? ofc i have to end the acquisition page too xD couldnt do anything today :( --Hikaru 0133, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
Main Templates
Anywho I'm quite divided on the manner. PAGENAME is great and easy and will take some time to do and be a bit repetitive internally, but (potentially, if the game updates with changes) a hassle to update down the road. Star switches take advantage of patterns and are easy in that way, but can't be as easily universally used and their implementation is likely to have more error.--Novaster 22:37, 1 September 2015 (UTC)
- Hi~ Well, i was thinking something like that xD acquisition's template is big but didnt know in how many parts slipt it. Defense (Helmet, Armour and Shield right?), Offense (Bomb, Handgun and Swords right?) and Misc (Trinkets and more, anything that doesnt belong in the first two) sounds good :3! The page wouldnt be so heavy and would be easy to look for an item if changes are needed. --Hikaru 23:29, 1 September 2015 (UTC)
- To be consistent with the material page and most other page templation, perhaps we should name the templates Weapon/Acquisition etc. instead of Acquisition/Weapon.--Novaster 23:51, 1 September 2015 (UTC)
- Yeah :D also the material page have Material/Acquisition so it would make sense :). --Hikaru 00:38, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
- To be consistent with the material page and most other page templation, perhaps we should name the templates Weapon/Acquisition etc. instead of Acquisition/Weapon.--Novaster 23:51, 1 September 2015 (UTC)
Split
Okay, feel free to divide into:
- Template:Armor/Acquisition
- Template:Helmet/Acquisition
- Template:Shield/Acquisition
- Template:Bomb/Acquisition
- Template:Handgun/Acquisition
- Template:Sword/Acquisition
- Template:Reskin/Acquisition
- Template:Trinket/Acquisition
- Template:Misc/Acquisition (a little weird)
It will take some time, I think. Let me know if there's problems. As you can imagine, I'm swamped with sapphires right now. --Novaster 22:18, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
- Haha i was about to ask for this! xD page is getting a problem with the weight haha. I see u was busy with sapphire, u were right xD. Im gonna do it then :) after im done adding the reward's adc' im going to split them :) do i split them with A-B-C-etc right? or star? --Hikaru 23:08, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
- I would prefer following the order that's on each item type's page (such as Armor). But since you're doing the work, do what's easier for you. --Novaster 22:30, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
- Armor's list (and the others) are in release's order right? i will do it like that :P. --Hikaru 23:08, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
- I would prefer following the order that's on each item type's page (such as Armor). But since you're doing the work, do what's easier for you. --Novaster 22:30, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
(3º) Third Phase
Basil Data
Hello there! I've volunteered to Novaster to be the slave, I mean wiki editor assistant, as far as Basil goes. =P Maybe my legwork can help you as well. I will be visiting Basil daily to check for recipes, so if you want I can keep you posted. Also the format in which Novaster made the list of recipes in Mission: In Cold Blood looks much better than the old format, so I will implement his format into other Missions recipes list. See you! -- MissNice 19:05, 4 September 2015 (UTC)
- Hi~ i was seeing the news, yesterday i couldnt log and tomorrow saturday and maybe sunday would be the same :(. Still i will work today, i was about to begin with basil ^^! I want do to novaster's template (Mission: In Cold Blood) too. But dunno which one data will u gather, basil's mission lobby or basil's arcada or both?. And yes i would like to see what u get ^^! U can keep writing me here~ --Hikaru 19:33, 4 September 2015 (UTC)
- Nice job on the templates! =) If you want, I can gather both data from Mission lobbies and Tier recipes. This just means i'll be ingame a lot, taking screenshots of Basil's recipes, checking for changes/patterns/other. If there is something specific you or Novaster want me to do, you can tell me. Until then, I'll be becoming Basil's new best friend. =P --MissNice 09:22, 5 September 2015 (UTC)
Report
So, today I've managed to check Basil's inventory from a few Mission Lobbies. Since I don't have time anymore, rather than to show you piece by piece data I've gathered, I'll message you tomorrow in one nice chunk all of Basil's inventory from Missions Lobbies, so I can cross Lobbies off my list, so I can move onto next big thing that really interests me and that is content of Basil's inventory in all Tiers and their random/maybeNotRandom/whoKnows rotation. Cheers! ---MissNice 14:52, 5 September 2015 (UTC)
- Looks like Hikaru already did this work - mission lobbies are the same for everyone. Wouldn't want you to spend the time/trouble doing something redundant. I would suggest utilizing Recent Changes or looking through Hikaru's contribs to see work that's been done. That being said, double checking the work is definitely worth doing. --Novaster 16:25, 5 September 2015 (UTC)
- Thank you for the links Novaster, you really try to be helpful, that's nice of you. =) And yes it's true, as far as I can see most of the recipes have already been checked and written by Hikaru. However, Basil holds more than just recipes in his inventory as we all know, capsules, vials and vitapods. Well, since Basil's page needs to get updated, well why not writing all that he has in his inventory in Mission Lobbies? Just because recipes are more important and it's something most people would want to look for, that doesn't mean we should ignore the rest, since some people actually do buy capsules and vitapods upfront. So I figured I would collect that data as well. It would be nice to see those written in the Wiki as well. But it's up to you guys to decide. Either way, the data is right here: User:MissNice#Basil (I didn't want to clutter your message board here, so instead it's all in the link). Cheers! --MissNice 16:42, 6 September 2015 (UTC)
Report - September 2015
A few things you might want to know.
- I've added Brinks's Inventory to my data list. I noticed you were working on his page so I figured you could use some fresh juicy data. =) >> User:MissNice#Brinks << It is a screenshot and not written form like I usually do, because there's just a ton of items and cause some of them are bind on purchase and some are not bind on purchase, so a visual representation of his inventory seemed like a better option for you to use. You can now use this and update Brinks's webpage. =)
- Also added Greave, Kragen, Ricasso, Quillion and Vatel Inventory data. But unlike Brinks, they have some items that show up randomly, so they need to be monitored for a while to place all items in there. I hope this is to your liking. =) Cheers! --MissNice 16:15, 24 September 2015 (UTC)
- OH yes yes! And a million yes! This is what i needed to do :3 specially Brinks and Vatel are the most who need it. I liked the way you add you, useful, less work and sorted. Im gonna add after finish my meal. Thx alot x3! Take care and really good job! --Hikaru 00:11, 25 September 2015 (UTC)
- Awesome, glad you like it! --MissNice 10:35, 24 September 2015 (UTC)
Trinkets
Hold on there, we're working on a master acquisition template remember? --Novaster 18:21, 7 October 2015 (UTC)
- Hahaha did you read my mind? haha i was thinking about that this exact second, was going to look for my files and be sure xD --Hikaru 19:23, 7 October 2015 (UTC)
- Do we create Trinket/Acquisition or add them in Misc? --Hikaru 19:24, 7 October 2015 (UTC)
- What do you think is best? I think Trinket/Acquisition, even though there's not many of them, they do have their own arsenal section. --Novaster 19:31, 7 October 2015 (UTC)
NPC Data Gathering
Hey Hikaru, doing well? =) Listen, I'm gonna be busy with work from now on, so I want to get this NPC data gathering over with, but I'll need some help finishing this up. Any ideas or suggestions? -MissNice 21:58, 18 November 2015 (UTC)
- Since it turned out that way, go here: my talk page. -MissNice 17:43, 19 November 2015 (UTC)
- Sorry i couldnt reply! Was busy this days, im fine how r u :)? was reading the talk page. seems good, gonna keep watching it for more info. I will try to do some of these things because i do not have much time today, probably, neither tomorrow, but i will try to do the much things i could do about that! Thx for the info Miss~ Let me write in ur talk page~ --Hikaru 00:38, 20 November 2015 (UTC)
Extras
Format Rewards
I have it like:
*Completion Reward:
:The recipe for this item is a reward for completing the {{Mission|NAME}} (bound/unbound)
and
*Completion Reward:
:This item is a reward for completing the {{Mission|NAME}} (bound/unbound)
Its okay? i saw in Emberbreak Shield that it was just: *The recipe for this item is a reward for completing the {{Mission|NAME}} (bound/unbound) --Hikaru 23:08, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
- Since there's only one entity in the "list" of this method of acquisition, I had it as a single bullet above vendors. Certain items only have one vendor, but consistency is better. I don't really know if there's an official formal format for this, perhaps instead of "completion reward" have "other" and have it below vendors? --Novaster 22:44, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
- I see it over vendors like the best way cuz is the easier way to get them xD. But i can add it with a * and erase de Completion Reward: and do the same with Bundle:. Seems better --Hikaru 23:08, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
Acquisition vs. idk :P
I'm thinking we remove the bullets if there's only one (non-trading/Auction House) method of acquisition. The Arcane Salamander Suit looks a little silly. --Novaster 14:11, 23 October 2015 (UTC)
- We can remove the bullet if the method is just one? and not with a selling vendor (item/recipe)? The Note (in the arcane suit) with the bullet does look silly xD looks like "incomplete" ahaha --Hikaru 17:39, 23 October 2015 (UTC)
Categories and Stalking lol
For the Basil subpages, I need to make a category just to keep track of them easily. I can add the cat to what's already been made if this is annoying, just be sure to add them to new pages as they're made. I didn't have this before because I wasn't sure we would use this format, but people really seem to like it! --Novaster 21:15, 4 September 2015 (UTC) Okay, I think I found them all. Add me in-game (IGN: Novaster) so we can talk easier there. --Novaster 21:27, 4 September 2015 (UTC)
- Okay then~ i will add u when i log in. Im going to travel from lobby to lobby to gather basil's info and make them in to templates --Hikaru 22:15, 4 September 2015 (UTC)
Memoramdum
Do not refer to the format on published pages. If it's the same, it's just coincidence or leftovers from testing when this project had higher priority. Stick to the examples already in the template. --Novaster 23:08, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
- Ok then, so * and : in the template. And from now i will ask in ur talk page. I just dont want to make spam in ur page. Wish this could have like a mini tiny chat lol sorry. --Hikaru 23:58, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
