Difference between revisions of "User talk:HikaruFer"

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~Hikaru~

NPC Format: almost there!?

Oh I remember why I started doing "Haven Town Square" etc. - it was because of the "Arcade" mission/exploration interface vs. the Haven Arcade location in Haven. Oh well. What do? --Novaster 11:10, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

After much napping upon this issue, I find myself most pleased with Archilus' page format. This would result in this format (I restored the linking in the brackets, as that's part of a template system and is convenient per section - overlinking is mostly an issue in paragraph format). If you agree with this layout, I will press forward with changes. --Novaster 10:41, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

I have made what I think is a better, less repetitive, more clear, less confusing, blahblah template for vendors. It needed to be done because their format is so...not in-sync with the rest of the wiki. It's still very beta, but I stuck it on Archilus' page for testing. What do you think so far? It might influence our format decisions. --Novaster 22:19, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

I have also put a demo on Talk:Brinks because he has an inventory with a lot of item type variety. My main goal is to ensure players understand that the vendor sells an ITEM, vs. a RECIPE for that item, and to make sure they don't miss that certain items can be bought with different things - Rock Salt for example, or Dark Harvest Prize Boxes for different candy tokens, and so on. If you like the format, feel free to make more entries, cross-referencing with in-game proofs and Miss-Nice's data to make sure it's up to date, because many pages are out of date. Or say you don't like it/there's problems.

And finally, how does this vendor list template influence our decision with the NPC page general format? (Should it be called WaresList instead?) I continue to prefer this version of Archilus the most. --Novaster 00:14, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

Considering the nature of the vendorlist template, and the general format of the entire wiki (players will likely try to find items via the main lists or the item pages, not NPC pages), I'm thinking it would be best to put wares on the bottom, above "See Also." The logic is the same as other pages with lists - lists are large and potentially forever-downward expanding, having content besides "see also" after lists isn't prudent. It also makes sense, because many lists are essentially sortable galleries (something I mentioned previously), though vendor lists are not as gallery-like as others. As soon as we agree, I'll make the changes, since I'm the one making a fuss about it and it would ultimately be my mess.

Compare:

• this version of Archilus, which I currently like the most
• this version of Archilus, which I like a lot, but now, not as much as the one above

I think letting the gallery have more than 3 per row really makes a huge difference, we just have to be careful, because not everyone has a large monitor. It looks fine on my laptop, which has a rather small screen. It will be horrid for phone browsers, but since this is a gaming wiki with a lot of information, catering to phones isn't prudent. --Novaster 01:01, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

Hey Nova~ how r u? ive been busy this days, well, i prefer the current version, the table does look a little big but i like it :) consistency :3. But i would change Notes for another word, and change the text to just Rank #-# because the "this items become etc etc" looks repetitive and innesesary, i put my browser tinier and make it "wider" (i think thats the word xD) but dunno which word can replace notes. On other news, i did update Brinks's inventory some weeks ago with MissNice's screen :) so its on date. Uhmmmm what else.... Oh well, Archilus' current page looks good, galery with 3 rows, wares at the bottom below see also. And the template of wares lookds good :) the name of the template its good, vendor sounds find. Gonna try to do some things before my free time runs out lol xD --Hikaru 00:52, 20 November 2015 (UTC)

What about the table on Talk:Brinks? Good? Bad? If Archilus' current page is fine, I will go ahead with the changes. I've made the HoH statement per row part of the vendorlist template, so we can easily change it whenever we want. And due to the arcade vs. Haven arcade thing, I think we should stick with Haven Garrison, Haven Town Square, etc. - because I remembered why I started doing it. --Novaster 02:27, 20 November 2015 (UTC)

Brinks is good :) but cost should be sorted so we can see the minimun. And about Haven (place) well, i did erase the ones i saw xD but ther is some other i didnt. Should stick forever with Have *place* then xD. In another note, i will probably wont be editing in a long time so thats why i been inactive, and probable will take a while till i can edit again :( i will try to finsih the transparency of the NPCs thats left tho --Hikaru 01:04, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

Oh nu. Well, I'm sure the transparencies will be bootyfull :). Regarding the sortability of the cost column, I was hoping to just maintain least to greatest (least at top, increasing down, within currency types) within the list, since sortability is very dumb unless you force it in the code (depends on first number in a number string, not the value of the entire number string directly) - and dual payment methods with more than one token type complicates things further. I can try to work it out if it's that important. In the meantime, looks like I have a ton of editing to do and no excuse to not do it! --Novaster 01:40, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

Oh well if it is a pain to do then doesnt need to :) though it would be simple to add but ur are right xD. Still the rest of the table is perfect :3! --Hikaru 03:05, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

Image Information

I feel that image information is a project for way down the road (the idea to do them popped into my head a while ago, after seeing images around other wikis where people had items that weren't the focus of the image and not knowing what they were was driving me insane). I'll certainly help with them, but right now NPCs, Monsters, and then Areas are taking priority. --Novaster 00:16, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

Oh yeah, im just finishing it because i left it in the half. I have a little time so i try to finished it if i can but for new overworld's file it could be added (at least, a note of item without the template) --Hikaru 00:18, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

As long as it's fun. I was worried it was being unfun based on the comment for help xD. I'm off for tonight, going to try to do one NPC page a day until they're done. The problem with these things is that they get all tangential with other topics, and I think I'll have to finish fixing Punch tomorrow. Really wish that Variant Forge interface wasn't so convoluted with the ticket icons. --Novaster 00:36, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

Ohhh haha dont worry :) wouldnt do it if it wasnt fun. Gambatte~ with the NPC's pages, sorry i cant help with that ^^U! Nite~ --Hikaru 00:39, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

Alternate name?

I'm certain that our news image redirects are not from "alternate names." They are their own entities. The act of redirecting is just proper laziness to avoid some large duplicate files. When Clotho responds to their talk page, I'm sure we can work on a project incorporating better redirects. It's best to not misuse redirect tags, as they're already confusing as is. --Novaster 23:29, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

Alternate name was the best i could think of xD I mean, if the News is "96" but the "173" is the same, it would fit that an "alternate name" for the 173's news is "96" right xD? I dont like to add redirect without putting them in a cat :( --Hikaru 23:33, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

I'll bring up the specific issue on Clotho's page. For the redirect tag itself, it should not be used this way, because they are their own entities - even if they happen to be the same, they have different names. Just like the icon for "regal bolted vee" and "regal headband" are the same visual but different names. --Novaster 23:36, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

I've brought it up. Just leave 'em alone for now, you do great work, and this is more work and is sadness because it's work to be re-done. The worst kind of work! --Novaster 23:39, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

As we are talking about new redirects, then we should keep the shortcut to general things, but create then a redirect from images and put all redirects to images (in ES wiki, i put redirects to prize box's icons) there. To me, it works with the actual redirects (till now) in the case of images but i did think in a new redirect when learning that you can redirects files to images without a problem. And luckly xD there arent much images here in the EN wiki to redirect :) but they are in the ES wiki xD --Hikaru 23:44, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

I'm fairly sure that's basically what I requested on Clotho's page. Hopefully we'll get the green light. --Novaster 23:52, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

AFAIK as a result of talking with Clotho about it, it's fine to make new redirect criteria VERY VERY VERY carefully and sparingly...so, I made Template:R to file. --Novaster 17:39, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

NPC Transparencies

When you feel like doing the NPC transparencies, can you make sure Herex doesn't have the artifact in the mugshot? Don't want ppl thinking that's a consistent part of his outfit. You can get to him quickly and easily in DaN for that shot. --Novaster 01:45, 10 December 2015 (UTC)

Newlines in templates

Hello! Just wanted to give you a small warning that newline symbols at the end (or beginning) of the template are also carried to the pages that use them. It's probably easiest to illustrate on the <noinclude> tags at the end of the templates. While it's pretty to write <noinclude>{{documentation}}</noinclude> on a new line, you also introduce here a new newline just before the noinclude tag. One way to avoid this is to write the starting <noinclude> on the preceding line with some text right before it. Then the newline will be within the noinclude tag and, due to what the tag does, will be present only on the template page where it will do no harm. Alternatively, you can use HTML comments to comment it out (<!--(newline)-->), but it's not very pretty. And of course, you can also put the "<noinclude>{{documentation}}</noinclude>" thing whole on the preceding line and don't worry about any newlines.

You can also come across this issue when you use the #ifeq or similar function. The newlines they may introduce are far trickier to get rid of. Here's one I was fixing recently: Template:CostumeTable/Start. I don't want to discourage you from using these functions, just to keep in mind some of the more subtle effects they may have.

The newlines are an issue when you transclude a template to another page. It hinders formating a bit. Single newline is ignored by the wiki, 2 newlines divide paragraphs and 3 or more add empty lines between the paragraphs. For example, in the News/2020 page, there is one empty line between each entry (2 newlines) and everything works fine. However, if the {{NewsTable}} template would have a newline at the end, then there could be at most 1 newline between the entries (1+1=2), otherwise all of them would break a little (there would be an empty line in the last column, 1+2=3). So the newlines aren't that big of a deal, sometimes it doesn't even have to be a problem, but it's best to avoid sending them to other pages somehow.

Also, for testing templates I sometimes use the Special:Expandtemplates page. I use it mostly as a second editor window for testing the changes without having to modify the original template to see the results and then reverting it back after the test. The additional info there may also be useful sometimes. --Matusm (talk) 21:24, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

Ohhh yeah, do u think it matters in the "fix" i been doing to the bosses page? (like, take Snarbolax for example). Since i did it like this to avoid a visual mess xd, i got lost looking for an specific word being all cramped. I remembered to dont add a newline at the Template:Boss when adding the auto-categories :D, that ended up fine right?. And in no way i find ur msg discouraging, i like to learn~ and as i said i forgot many of the "rules" for the templates so i only edit them if i want to test a fix or add something i think its needed; im guilty of using the "enter" key too much sometimes, its a mania xd i try to just add one between each }} {{ just so i or any other wikieditor dont get lost between each entry (like the news/2020) but when i edit a template i (most of the time) have to test if everything ended up fine, like, when i shorted the APNG's template and earsed a newline and then the boxes glued each other badly so i was like "oh kk that was there for a reason" *manually revert* xd. Next time im gonna try the special template u mention :D.

Feel free to leave me more msgs like this~ HikaruFer (talk) 21:57, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

Yes, it matters in this case. You've introduced a newline at the end of the Boss template, so now the boss pages have one empty line at the beginning. If you edit the Snarbolax page, remove one newline that follows the Boss template and preview it, the empty line at the beginning should disappear. But of course, this should be fixed in the template, not pages. :P

The 2 newlines between news entries are fine, even newlines inside the templates may be fine. The only issue are newlines near beginning and end of the template. I like when the templates are nicely readable, too, but often it's because of weird rules like these that you can't make the templates look very pretty. This one rule specifically is responsible for the long <includeonly><noinclude> chains at the ends. But it's also thanks to this rule that you can put that many enters between entries. :D --Matusm (talk) 23:27, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

OHHH i saw it xdd i didnt notice it, i mean, not that it was due a newline in the template xd. jajaja its funny how that simple "enter" caused that xd. Now it looks prettier :D~. Thx for telling me this way~ if u edit it i wouldnt have understand where and why that newline caused what it did HikaruFer (talk) 23:34, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

No problem. I'm happy it worked out well. :) --Matusm (talk) 00:04, 20 March 2020 (UTC)